Development mailing list

Syndicate content
Archive of posts for haiku-development at FreeLists
Updated: 44 min 37 sec ago

[haiku-development] Re: Haiku, Inc. in Contempt of Its Community (Kacper Kasper)

Wed, 2015-02-18 22:45
2015-02-17 18:02 GMT+01:00 Donn Cave donn@xxxxxxxxxxx: I don't see any major problem with the current configuration, but it would be a bad move to make the production release configuration hostile to anyone but this narrow definition of end users. How is having an additional element in the path hostile? If you are power user you can figure it out. If you can't then our documentation is lacking, not the implementation. - Kacper ...
Categories: Development

[haiku-development] Re: Haiku, Inc. in Contempt of Its Community (Donn Cave)

Wed, 2015-02-18 14:45
Quoth Kacper Kasper kacperkasper@xxxxxxxxx, By non-developers Augustin meant people who do not develop SOFTWARE, not just Haiku. If you do that, you're either software developer or power user, and both in my opinion do not fit the definition of end user we are talking about here. I think that's an artificial and unproductive distinction. Early in the game, power users of one sort or another are not only end users, they're ...
Categories: Development

[haiku-development] Re: Haiku, Inc. in Contempt of Its Community (Stefano Ceccherini)

Wed, 2015-02-18 12:45
Il 17/feb/2015 16:49 Jonathan Beatty easyegoism@xxxxxxxxx ha scritto: Absurd argument. I'm not a developer of Linux, although I use it all the time, and I put scripts and binaries wherever I please quite frequently. Contempt of community indeed. Well, if you're really putting scripts and binaries wherever you want in Linux you're doing it wrong, since you're supposed to use /usr/local/bin or the other local paths which (oh no!) are longer than the respective packaged paths, just like on haiku with PM. ...
Categories: Development

[haiku-development] Re: Haiku, Inc. in Contempt of Its Community (Ingo Weinhold)

Wed, 2015-02-18 12:45
On 02/17/2015 04:49 PM, Jonathan Beatty wrote: Absurd argument. I'm not a developer of Linux, although I use it all the time, and I put scripts and binaries wherever I please quite frequently. Contempt of community indeed. First of all: Please don't top-post. ...
Categories: Development

[haiku-development] Re: Haiku, Inc. in Contempt of Its Community (Kacper Kasper)

Wed, 2015-02-18 10:45
2015-02-17 16:49 GMT+01:00 Jonathan Beatty easyegoism@xxxxxxxxx: Absurd argument. I'm not a developer of Linux, although I use it all the time, and I put scripts and binaries wherever I please quite frequently. Absurd as well. By non-developers Augustin meant people who do not develop SOFTWARE, not just Haiku. If you do that, you're either software developer or power user, and both in my opinion do not fit the definition of end user we are talking about here. - Kacper ...
Categories: Development

[haiku-development] Re: Haiku, Inc. in Contempt of Its Community (Jonathan Beatty)

Wed, 2015-02-18 10:45
Absurd argument. I'm not a developer of Linux, although I use it all the time, and I put scripts and binaries wherever I please quite frequently. Contempt of community indeed. On Tue, Feb 17, 2015, 9:46 AM Augustin Cavalier waddlesplash@xxxxxxxxx wrote: On Tue, Feb 17, 2015 at 10:41 AM, Jim Saxton black.belt.jimmy@xxxxxxxxx wrote: ...
Categories: Development

[haiku-development] Re: Haiku, Inc. in Contempt of Its Community (Augustin Cavalier)

Wed, 2015-02-18 10:45
On Tue, Feb 17, 2015 at 10:41 AM, Jim Saxton black.belt.jimmy@xxxxxxxxx wrote: Using this tree structure will increased the support time needed by new users. It will devrease the adoption rate for haiku when it reaches r1. On the contrary: the end users (who aren't developers) should not even know about this. ...
Categories: Development

[haiku-development] Re: package / non-packaged (was Haiku, Inc. etc.) (Augustin Cavalier)

Wed, 2015-02-18 10:45
On Tue, Feb 17, 2015 at 10:37 AM, Donn Cave donn@xxxxxxxxxxx wrote: That seems like asking for trouble - provide a non-packaged alternative to the package system, but say (to yourselves) it's not really to be used. So you can pull it later, and say no one should have using it? It seems unlikely that there will ever be any need to lock the system down to packaged files only, why not accept this as a virtue of the design? No. Having non-packaged is very useful to developers, who may want to test ...
Categories: Development

[haiku-development] Re: Haiku, Inc. in Contempt of Its Community (Jim Saxton)

Wed, 2015-02-18 10:45
On 2/17/15, Augustin Cavalier waddlesplash@xxxxxxxxx wrote: On 2/16/2015 11:12 PM, Chase Rayfield (Redacted sender cusbrar2@xxxxxxxxx for DMARC) wrote: ~/config/ and ~/config/non-packaged over ~/config/packaged and ~/config Because ~/config/non-packaged was/is supposed to be temporary and only used by e.g. developers testing software. End-users should get all their software via HPKGs, or unzip and run anywhere. ...
Categories: Development

[haiku-development] package / non-packaged (was Haiku, Inc. etc.) (Donn Cave)

Wed, 2015-02-18 10:45
Quoth Augustin Cavalier waddlesplash@xxxxxxxxx, Because ~/config/non-packaged was/is supposed to be temporary and only used by e.g. developers testing software. End-users should get all their software via HPKGs, or unzip and run anywhere. That seems like asking for trouble - provide a non-packaged alternative to the package system, but say (to yourselves) it's not really to be used. So you can pull it later, and say no one should have using it? It seems unlikely that there will ever be any need to lock the system down to ...
Categories: Development

[haiku-development] Re: Haiku, Inc. in Contempt of Its Community (Augustin Cavalier)

Wed, 2015-02-18 10:45
On 2/16/2015 11:12 PM, Chase Rayfield (Redacted sender cusbrar2@xxxxxxxxx for DMARC) wrote: ~/config/ and ~/config/non-packaged over ~/config/packaged and ~/config Because ~/config/non-packaged was/is supposed to be temporary and only used by e.g. developers testing software. End-users should get all their ...
Categories: Development

[haiku-development] Re: Haiku, Inc. in Contempt of Its Community (Augustin Cavalier)

Wed, 2015-02-18 08:45
On 2/16/2015 8:54 PM, Pete Goodeve wrote: Please don't assume that I'm stupid.... I don't think you're stupid :) But if you have some error messages or descriptions of what didn't work, please don't hesitate to tell me! -Augustin ...
Categories: Development

[haiku-development] Re: Haiku, Inc. in Contempt of Its Community (Stephan Aßmus)

Wed, 2015-02-18 08:45
Am 15.02.2015 um 23:50 schrieb pete.goodeve@xxxxxxxxxxxx: On Sun, Feb 15, 2015 at 10:06:09AM -0800, Jim Saxton wrote: The proper way to accomplish this would have been to leve the directory system as it was under the home directory but add a ...
Categories: Development

[haiku-development] Re: Haiku, Inc. in Contempt of Its Community (Adrien Destugues)

Wed, 2015-02-18 08:45
On Mon, Feb 16, 2015 at 03:02:51PM -0800, Yourself wrote: On Mon, Feb 16, 2015 at 09:25:02PM +0100, Axel D?rfler wrote: On 02/16/2015 07:53 PM, Jim Saxton wrote: This argument is flawed. One could use B_USER_LIB_DIRECTORY to place your program's special lib in and still come up with a read-only directory. Lets face it, like it or not, changing the directory structure changed the user interface and the appi. Only in theory -- of course, this is a huge change from before, but you would place your library in a Software Valet package and tell it to put ...
Categories: Development

[haiku-development] Re: Haiku, Inc. in Contempt of Its Community (Chase Rayfield)

Wed, 2015-02-18 08:45
What exactly is the reason for choosing ~/config/ and ~/config/non-packaged over ~/config/packaged and ~/config Is this something to do with having a RO file tree with RW overlays or something of that nature? Actually, it would seem more logical to me to have a normal BFS mounted RW with the linux equivalent of loop mounts for the packages a la DSL packages or Puppylinux environment addons (they used to package the toolchain as a squashfs I imagine they still do).  From what I understood of the package format it does work as loop mounts with ...
Categories: Development

[haiku-development] Re: Haiku, Inc. in Contempt of Its Community (Pete Goodeve)

Wed, 2015-02-18 08:45
On Mon, Feb 16, 2015 at 08:00:22PM -0500, Augustin Cavalier wrote: On 2/16/2015 7:58 PM, Pete Goodeve wrote: Well, no. The whole point/problem is that I have tons of stuff in ~/config/bin, ../add-ons, .../lib, and so on. (Even had ~/config/apps for a long time for convenience, but that got moved to /boot/common/apps(!)) Then you could have copied all the stuff from ~/config into ~/config/non-packaged. -Augustin ...
Categories: Development

[haiku-development] Re: Haiku, Inc. in Contempt of Its Community (Augustin Cavalier)

Wed, 2015-02-18 08:45
On 2/16/2015 7:58 PM, Pete Goodeve wrote: Well, no. The whole point/problem is that I have tons of stuff in ~/config/bin, ../add-ons, .../lib, and so on. (Even had ~/config/apps for a long time for convenience, but that got moved to /boot/common/apps(!)) Then you could have copied all the stuff from ~/config into ~/config/non-packaged. ...
Categories: Development

[haiku-development] Re: Haiku, Inc. in Contempt of Its Community (Pete Goodeve)

Wed, 2015-02-18 08:45
On Mon, Feb 16, 2015 at 07:14:12PM -0500, Augustin Cavalier wrote: On 2/16/2015 6:02 PM, I wrote: (I should probably mention that I eventually got most of the environment I had built up in pre-PM days now working in a PM partition by a horrible hack! I turned everyting in my old config hierarchy into an hpkg and installed that!) Well, ~/config/settings is still writeable so if that's all you wanted to keep, a tgz would have been enough... Well, no. The whole point/problem is that I have tons of stuff in ...
Categories: Development

[haiku-development] Re: Haiku, Inc. in Contempt of Its Community (Augustin Cavalier)

Wed, 2015-02-18 08:45
On 2/16/2015 6:02 PM, Yourself wrote: (I should probably mention that I eventually got most of the environment I had built up in pre-PM days now working in a PM partition by a horrible hack! I turned everyting in my old config hierarchy into an hpkg and installed that!) Well, ~/config/settings is still writeable so if that's all you wanted to keep, a tgz would have been enough... ...
Categories: Development

[haiku-development] Re: Haiku, Inc. in Contempt of Its Community (Yourself)

Wed, 2015-02-18 08:45
On Mon, Feb 16, 2015 at 09:25:02PM +0100, Axel D?rfler wrote: On 02/16/2015 07:53 PM, Jim Saxton wrote: This argument is flawed. One could use B_USER_LIB_DIRECTORY to place your program's special lib in and still come up with a read-only directory. Lets face it, like it or not, changing the directory structure changed the user interface and the appi. Only in theory -- of course, this is a huge change from before, but you would place your library in a Software Valet package and tell it to put it into B_USER_LIB_DIRECTORY, and everything would continue to work. ...
Categories: Development